<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Criminalizing Society</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/</link>
	<description>A blog from inside the emergency department</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 00:58:44 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.5.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: DensityDuck</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-103466</link>
		<dc:creator>DensityDuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2012 00:43:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-103466</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You can tell when they know they haven&#039;t got an argument, because out comes the thesarus.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You can tell when they know they haven&#8217;t got an argument, because out comes the thesarus.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DdR</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102854</link>
		<dc:creator>DdR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 17:08:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102854</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Things are definitely getting out of hand. Things have gotten to the point that my husband and I have begun talking about retiring elsewhere.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Things are definitely getting out of hand. Things have gotten to the point that my husband and I have begun talking about retiring elsewhere.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Matt</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102800</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 04:58:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102800</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Look, it&#039;s not worth getting into, and I understand it&#039;s hard to see it in yourself.  You just did it again in your first paragraph with your use of &quot;fair&quot;.   

Love the last paragraph though.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look, it&#8217;s not worth getting into, and I understand it&#8217;s hard to see it in yourself.  You just did it again in your first paragraph with your use of &#8220;fair&#8221;.   </p>
<p>Love the last paragraph though.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: WhiteCoat</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102793</link>
		<dc:creator>WhiteCoat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 03:23:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102793</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Same old untrue rhetoric. 

You know and I know that I never said that I don&#039;t want civil cases. That&#039;s a huge misrepresentation. I want a fair civil system. The current system is not fair.
I&#039;ve advocated a &quot;loser pays&quot; civil system. You just make up excuses why the US can&#039;t follow the lead of the rest of civilized society in implementing it. 

I also never said that I don&#039;t want customer satisfaction surveys. I only assert that the statistical methods used to compare the surveys need to be sound. Currently, they are nowhere close to being sound. 

And if you want to allow criminalization of every profession on its judgment calls, go for it. Costs and bureaucracy will skyrocket because few will be willing to leave decisions to judgment lest they lose their freedom. Society would be so well served, wouldn&#039;t it?
Let&#039;s add prosecutors and judges to the list while we&#039;re at it.

This isn&#039;t an issue of accountability and you know it. When we don&#039;t scrutinize egregious acts of those holding us &quot;accountable&quot; we encourage those in power to continue acting egregiously.

Your problems are that you lack both foresight and insight, that you are prone to confabulation, and that you obviously have little knowledge about some of the issues upon which you opine.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Same old untrue rhetoric. </p>
<p>You know and I know that I never said that I don&#8217;t want civil cases. That&#8217;s a huge misrepresentation. I want a fair civil system. The current system is not fair.<br />
I&#8217;ve advocated a &#8220;loser pays&#8221; civil system. You just make up excuses why the US can&#8217;t follow the lead of the rest of civilized society in implementing it. </p>
<p>I also never said that I don&#8217;t want customer satisfaction surveys. I only assert that the statistical methods used to compare the surveys need to be sound. Currently, they are nowhere close to being sound. </p>
<p>And if you want to allow criminalization of every profession on its judgment calls, go for it. Costs and bureaucracy will skyrocket because few will be willing to leave decisions to judgment lest they lose their freedom. Society would be so well served, wouldn&#8217;t it?<br />
Let&#8217;s add prosecutors and judges to the list while we&#8217;re at it.</p>
<p>This isn&#8217;t an issue of accountability and you know it. When we don&#8217;t scrutinize egregious acts of those holding us &#8220;accountable&#8221; we encourage those in power to continue acting egregiously.</p>
<p>Your problems are that you lack both foresight and insight, that you are prone to confabulation, and that you obviously have little knowledge about some of the issues upon which you opine.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Matt</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102784</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 02:21:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102784</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I get the claim he&#039;s trying to make.  The problem is that by the time you eliminate all the people that physicians don&#039;t want to be able to hold them accountable, you&#039;re left with policing by the individual who supposedly did the act or omission.

The chance that the &quot;best possible work&quot; will land him in jail or on skid row is so infinitesimal as to be nonexistent.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I get the claim he&#8217;s trying to make.  The problem is that by the time you eliminate all the people that physicians don&#8217;t want to be able to hold them accountable, you&#8217;re left with policing by the individual who supposedly did the act or omission.</p>
<p>The chance that the &#8220;best possible work&#8221; will land him in jail or on skid row is so infinitesimal as to be nonexistent.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102757</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 21:58:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102757</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I could not agree with you more. I have been saying for years (at first 100% joking) that slowly, every day, Russia gets more like the USA and the USA gets more like [the old] Russia. It&#039;s no longer a joke, it&#039;s true and very scary. More and more I am seeing people who make total, 100% mistakes that in years past might result in a lawsuit now resulting in criminal charges. An amusment ride worker by total accident does something that severly injures a rider and he is charged with a felony. An off duty police officer by total accident has the gun he is 100% legally carrying slip from his pocket and discharge - no one, thankfully, is hurt but he is charged and convicted. Another police officer drives through a red light with lights and siren activated, hits another car, and stands trial - thank God, the sain jurey found her not guilty. It just goes on and on. I am very, very scared for this country in so many ways and it just gets worse and worse and worse. People are charged with crimes for posting words or a photo on Facebook. What has happened to our country? I&#039;m starting to feel like one of those anti-government nuts I used to laugh at. I&#039;m no longer laughing.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I could not agree with you more. I have been saying for years (at first 100% joking) that slowly, every day, Russia gets more like the USA and the USA gets more like [the old] Russia. It&#8217;s no longer a joke, it&#8217;s true and very scary. More and more I am seeing people who make total, 100% mistakes that in years past might result in a lawsuit now resulting in criminal charges. An amusment ride worker by total accident does something that severly injures a rider and he is charged with a felony. An off duty police officer by total accident has the gun he is 100% legally carrying slip from his pocket and discharge &#8211; no one, thankfully, is hurt but he is charged and convicted. Another police officer drives through a red light with lights and siren activated, hits another car, and stands trial &#8211; thank God, the sain jurey found her not guilty. It just goes on and on. I am very, very scared for this country in so many ways and it just gets worse and worse and worse. People are charged with crimes for posting words or a photo on Facebook. What has happened to our country? I&#8217;m starting to feel like one of those anti-government nuts I used to laugh at. I&#8217;m no longer laughing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tarl</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102744</link>
		<dc:creator>Tarl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:58:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102744</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The point Whitecoat is making is that we are responding to the vagaries of reality (sometimes even the most competent person using his training and knowledge in the prescribed way can have a bad result) with criminal penalties.

Whitecoat works in a field where every treatment has the potential of someone dying, and doesn&#039;t like the fact that his best possible work may still land him in jail for manslaughter (or skid row for malpractice). We generally like to believe that criminal and civil penalties only attach for doing something wrong.

In the case from Italy that I highlighted, reaction from the scientific world has been dumfounded disbelief. More specific details on what went down:
http://www.nature.com/news/shock-and-law-1.11643

Whitecoat likes to bemoan what&#039;s happening to our country, but it&#039;s not really local to the U.S. - it&#039;s generalizing to western society worldwide.

In the case of Italy, if they ever ask me a question in my professional capacity (which isn&#039;t medical), I&#039;m going to tell them to piss off, I refuse to reply on grounds that doing my job might get me thrown in jail.

We expect such behavior from barbarian dictatorships (remember the Bulgarian nurses in Libya?), but we&#039;re surprised when ostensibly civilized countries pull this kind of stunt.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The point Whitecoat is making is that we are responding to the vagaries of reality (sometimes even the most competent person using his training and knowledge in the prescribed way can have a bad result) with criminal penalties.</p>
<p>Whitecoat works in a field where every treatment has the potential of someone dying, and doesn&#8217;t like the fact that his best possible work may still land him in jail for manslaughter (or skid row for malpractice). We generally like to believe that criminal and civil penalties only attach for doing something wrong.</p>
<p>In the case from Italy that I highlighted, reaction from the scientific world has been dumfounded disbelief. More specific details on what went down:<br />
<a href="http://www.nature.com/news/shock-and-law-1.11643" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/news/shock-and-law-1.11643</a></p>
<p>Whitecoat likes to bemoan what&#8217;s happening to our country, but it&#8217;s not really local to the U.S. &#8211; it&#8217;s generalizing to western society worldwide.</p>
<p>In the case of Italy, if they ever ask me a question in my professional capacity (which isn&#8217;t medical), I&#8217;m going to tell them to piss off, I refuse to reply on grounds that doing my job might get me thrown in jail.</p>
<p>We expect such behavior from barbarian dictatorships (remember the Bulgarian nurses in Libya?), but we&#8217;re surprised when ostensibly civilized countries pull this kind of stunt.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Shelby</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102721</link>
		<dc:creator>Shelby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 17:54:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102721</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Anyone who believes that healthcare in the US is getting better is drinking koolaid that I wish I could drink before going to work.

We have to jump through more hoops to get paid, are expected to run around like crazy to treat patients, many of whom aren&#039;t really emergency patients.  We get assaulted &amp; at least in my hospital, aren&#039;t allowed to press charges. And we get sued or charged with criminal charges. It just keeps getting worse.

Is this healthcare reform?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anyone who believes that healthcare in the US is getting better is drinking koolaid that I wish I could drink before going to work.</p>
<p>We have to jump through more hoops to get paid, are expected to run around like crazy to treat patients, many of whom aren&#8217;t really emergency patients.  We get assaulted &amp; at least in my hospital, aren&#8217;t allowed to press charges. And we get sued or charged with criminal charges. It just keeps getting worse.</p>
<p>Is this healthcare reform?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Matt</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102710</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 16:47:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102710</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[WC, you have a point - to an extent.  But your standard seems to be that you don&#039;t want criminal charges, you don&#039;t want civil cases, you don&#039;t want customer satisfaction surveys, etc.

You want to hold doctors to one standard - the &quot;does WC think it&#039;s wrong&quot; standard based solely on what HE knows about the case.  You don&#039;t seem to believe any other group can get it right.

Your problem may be less with the systems we have designed to handle this than recognizing you may be wrong sometimes or may not know all the facts.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WC, you have a point &#8211; to an extent.  But your standard seems to be that you don&#8217;t want criminal charges, you don&#8217;t want civil cases, you don&#8217;t want customer satisfaction surveys, etc.</p>
<p>You want to hold doctors to one standard &#8211; the &#8220;does WC think it&#8217;s wrong&#8221; standard based solely on what HE knows about the case.  You don&#8217;t seem to believe any other group can get it right.</p>
<p>Your problem may be less with the systems we have designed to handle this than recognizing you may be wrong sometimes or may not know all the facts.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ThorMD</title>
		<link>http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/2012/10/criminalizing-society/#comment-102648</link>
		<dc:creator>ThorMD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 01:21:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epmonthly.com/whitecoat/?p=8682#comment-102648</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A lot of these fraud cases look pretty egregious to me.  When docs and nurses go that far off the reservation, I don&#039;t have problem with a crackdown.   I&#039;m a little embarrassed that our government hasn&#039;t done more in the past to catch some of these ridiculous claims

As for the State medical boards -  I&#039;m too afraid to publicly slam them lest they find out my true identity and decide to crack down on me for no good reason like they have done to so many others.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A lot of these fraud cases look pretty egregious to me.  When docs and nurses go that far off the reservation, I don&#8217;t have problem with a crackdown.   I&#8217;m a little embarrassed that our government hasn&#8217;t done more in the past to catch some of these ridiculous claims</p>
<p>As for the State medical boards &#8211;  I&#8217;m too afraid to publicly slam them lest they find out my true identity and decide to crack down on me for no good reason like they have done to so many others.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
